Wheels again today (et cetera).
Continuing from the other day.
I changed the rear rim on the Axiom Disc to
this rim.
It had a Shimano freebody attached,
but the customer left me with a SRAM XDR freebody
so I'm swapping it out for that one.
The freebody spline had tape on it,
and even though it's an unused wheel
the Instant Drive 360 proprietary grease
had already been cleared off the ratchet surfaces,
and was oozing out all over the place.
For a Mavic rear wheel, the centering offset is pretty small.
By the way, this is the state before freebody replacement,
but on this wheel the freebody swap
doesn't change the wheel center.
When I disassembled the wheel,
unlike the front wheel, the spoke lengths differed between left and right,
measuring 4mm different in actual length.
That's odd.
The hub is indeed high-low flange,
but when I measured the hub dimensions myself
and checked the left-right spoke length difference,
it came out to about 2mm difference.
As I wrote about the front wheel,
even if the left and right spoke lengths differ by
about 1mm on the front wheel and 2mm on the rear
due to variations in spoke nipples,
if you lengthen the thread length like these spokes
compared to generic spokes, you get redundancy in that length,
making it possible to use the same spokes on both sides.
But this 4mm difference basically hits the short limit on the short side
and maxes out the long limit on the long side.
In other words, you could apparently make it work with just one intermediate length
within this 4mm difference for both sides,
yet they're deliberately using two types of edge-case different lengths—
it makes no sense.
When changing the rim, I'm cutting the spoke length,
but in the subsequent thread rolling,
I can only create spoke thread length matching generic spokes.
That means I don't get the redundancy from special thread lengths,
but I set the left-right difference to 2mm and actually got the wheel together.
This proves you don't need a 4mm left-right difference.
Got it together.
I didn't photograph the original state,
but looking only at the final cross overlap,
I changed it from what looked like reverse JIS lacing
to what looks like JIS lacing.
The image above is taken from the wheel's right side (drive side).
With butted spokes doing double cross,
the final cross appearance reverses like a mirror image,
so Mavic's original interpretation isn't entirely wrong.
However, I don't interpret the contact at the flattened section
of these Axiom spokes as "weaving,"
so I prioritized the appearance of the final cross.
What matters is that, for example, with JIS lacing,
when viewing the wheel from the right side,
the inpokes on the drive side go in the porcupine direction,
and on the non-drive side in the reverse porcupine direction—
but on this hub the left-right position of the spoke heads is identical,
so the usual interpretation of inpoke/outpoke that applies to normal wheels
doesn't exist on the hub side, meaning there's no single correct answer.
If you determine the spoke overlap form based on the direction of the "woven cross"
that first receives the twisting stress from pedaling torque transmitted through the hub,
then if you interpret the flat section contact near the spoke head on the Axiom
as "weaving," Mavic would be correct.
Ultimately it comes down to whether you interpret the cross just before the final cross
as weaving or not.
So if you were to build this wheel without weaving the final cross,
would you build it according to the Mavic interpretation?
That's the tricky question.
If the answer is yes, it contradicts the earlier statement about
not interpreting the flat section contact as weaving.
↑rear wheel
↑front wheel
The hub shell phase through the valve hole was off,
so I aligned it as much as possible with the MAVIC logo,
but this customer is the type tonever mind cheap brands like Tni or Chinese ones
peel off rim stickers even on major wheel brands
(would peel off Cosmic Carbon too if they could),
so this consideration will likely be wasted effort.
I didn't record the weight of the carbon rim after rebuilding
because I didn't ask the customer where it came from
and frankly I'm not interested.
Put another way,
it has no value as blog content.
But the Axiom Disc rim is probably different.
If someone's already using the wheel in practice
and could know the rim's weight, they'd want to know it,
or it might be useful reference when buying one—
way more people would care about that than some no-name carbon rim.
So no, I'm not telling.
Why would I just hand that out?
↑ugh what a jerk
Sorry for the wait! Please take a look at this image!
I don't think there's any difference,
but the top one is the front rim and the bottom is the rear rim!
↑stop it!
Continuing from the other day.
I changed the rear rim on the Axiom Disc to
this rim.
It had a Shimano freebody attached,
but the customer left me with a SRAM XDR freebody
so I'm swapping it out for that one.
The freebody spline had tape on it,
and even though it's an unused wheel
the Instant Drive 360 proprietary grease
had already been cleared off the ratchet surfaces,
and was oozing out all over the place.
For a Mavic rear wheel, the centering offset is pretty small.
By the way, this is the state before freebody replacement,
but on this wheel the freebody swap
doesn't change the wheel center.
When I disassembled the wheel,
unlike the front wheel, the spoke lengths differed between left and right,
measuring 4mm different in actual length.
That's odd.
The hub is indeed high-low flange,
but when I measured the hub dimensions myself
and checked the left-right spoke length difference,
it came out to about 2mm difference.
As I wrote about the front wheel,
even if the left and right spoke lengths differ by
about 1mm on the front wheel and 2mm on the rear
due to variations in spoke nipples,
if you lengthen the thread length like these spokes
compared to generic spokes, you get redundancy in that length,
making it possible to use the same spokes on both sides.
But this 4mm difference basically hits the short limit on the short side
and maxes out the long limit on the long side.
In other words, you could apparently make it work with just one intermediate length
within this 4mm difference for both sides,
yet they're deliberately using two types of edge-case different lengths—
it makes no sense.
When changing the rim, I'm cutting the spoke length,
but in the subsequent thread rolling,
I can only create spoke thread length matching generic spokes.
That means I don't get the redundancy from special thread lengths,
but I set the left-right difference to 2mm and actually got the wheel together.
This proves you don't need a 4mm left-right difference.
Got it together.
I didn't photograph the original state,
but looking only at the final cross overlap,
I changed it from what looked like reverse JIS lacing
to what looks like JIS lacing.
The image above is taken from the wheel's right side (drive side).
With butted spokes doing double cross,
the final cross appearance reverses like a mirror image,
so Mavic's original interpretation isn't entirely wrong.
However, I don't interpret the contact at the flattened section
of these Axiom spokes as "weaving,"
so I prioritized the appearance of the final cross.
What matters is that, for example, with JIS lacing,
when viewing the wheel from the right side,
the inpokes on the drive side go in the porcupine direction,
and on the non-drive side in the reverse porcupine direction—
but on this hub the left-right position of the spoke heads is identical,
so the usual interpretation of inpoke/outpoke that applies to normal wheels
doesn't exist on the hub side, meaning there's no single correct answer.
If you determine the spoke overlap form based on the direction of the "woven cross"
that first receives the twisting stress from pedaling torque transmitted through the hub,
then if you interpret the flat section contact near the spoke head on the Axiom
as "weaving," Mavic would be correct.
Ultimately it comes down to whether you interpret the cross just before the final cross
as weaving or not.
So if you were to build this wheel without weaving the final cross,
would you build it according to the Mavic interpretation?
That's the tricky question.
If the answer is yes, it contradicts the earlier statement about
not interpreting the flat section contact as weaving.
↑rear wheel
↑front wheel
The hub shell phase through the valve hole was off,
so I aligned it as much as possible with the MAVIC logo,
but this customer is the type to
peel off rim stickers even on major wheel brands
(would peel off Cosmic Carbon too if they could),
so this consideration will likely be wasted effort.
I didn't record the weight of the carbon rim after rebuilding
because I didn't ask the customer where it came from
and frankly I'm not interested.
Put another way,
it has no value as blog content.
But the Axiom Disc rim is probably different.
If someone's already using the wheel in practice
and could know the rim's weight, they'd want to know it,
or it might be useful reference when buying one—
way more people would care about that than some no-name carbon rim.
So no, I'm not telling.
Why would I just hand that out?
↑ugh what a jerk
Sorry for the wait! Please take a look at this image!
I don't think there's any difference,
but the top one is the front rim and the bottom is the rear rim!
↑stop it!